Hip-hop’s underground rattled when rapper El-P ever so bluntly declared on his acclaimed solo debut last year, Fantastic Damage: ” Signed to Rawkus? I’d rather be mouth fucked by Nazis unconscious.” Rawkus Records, the home of late-90s landmarks Soundbombing, Mos Def and El-P’s group Company Flow, was losing its grip on the ” it” label for underground hip-hop.
Definitive Jux, a New York-based label founded by El-P, was more than willing to take its place. Def Jux, as it is popularly known, has featured strong releases from rappers Mr. Lif, Aesop Rock and Murs, but one of its most unlikely stars is DJ, producer and instrumental hip-hop artist RJD2.
Deadringer, the 2002 solo debut from Columbus, Ohio-raised RJD2 , is a sprawling, raw instrumental hip-hop album, standing out from the legions of other sample-based records with its creativity and tight song structure. After having received critical acclaim for Dead Ringer, RJD2 turned to producing. He laid down tracks for artists such as El-P and underground hip-hop legend Aceyalone and remixed a track off of Massive Attack’s newest album, 100th Window. He also found time to release two EP’s: The Horror, a solo effort, and Unlimited from the group Soul Position, an RJD2 collaboration with rapper Blueprint. The oft-delayed debut LP from Soul Position, 8 Million Stories, will be released Oct. 7 on Rhymesayers Records. The Voice spoke with RJD2 about Soul Position, the current state of hip hop, and his odd penchant for putting cracked skulls on his album covers.
Voice Leisure: Are you happy with the way the Soul Position album turned out?
RJD2: I mean that’s a tough question for me to answer because I don’t like anything when it’s done. I look back on everything and all I see are stupid mistakes I’ve made. It’s another record I did. I’m happy with it. But I’m not the kind of guy that sits around and is like, ” I did something really good.” I’m always thinking about what’s next and how I can do better next time.
Voice Leisure: So what is next for you?
RJD2: Recording-wise, I’m working on my next album. I’m just putting all my energies in that. That’s really it. I’m trying to enjoy life. I’ve been a workaholic for a long time.
Voice Leisure: On the Soul Position record you did production, but you’re just as well known, if not better known as a DJ. Which do you like better?
RJD2: DJing is fun. It’s not rocket science, but it’s fun. Production is my first love because it goes with my perfectionist leanings. The problem I have with DJing is that at your best all that you can do is not make any mistakes. With production, I feel like there’s so much more to be done, so I can take weeks or months to get everything perfect in a song. DJing is the kind of thing that when I’m away from it, I really don’t think it’s that fun. I get done DJing a gig and I’m like, ” Oh that was fun, I had a good time.” But I’ll wake up the next morning and be like, ” Fuck DJing, I hate that shit.”
Voice Leisure: What do you think of the rise of the ” super-producer” in hip-hop and even pop music at this point? Do you think it’s a good or bad thing for hip-hop?
RJD2: I think that it’s justified. I got into hip-hop when I was younger because of lyrics and stuff. But then it really hit home on a much bigger level psychologically and emotionally, and all that it was because of the music, the production, the instrumentation. That’s what was really powerful to me. Things like Public Enemy’s Nation of Millions and a lot of things from that era, 1988 to ‘93, were really moving to me instrumentally and I think it’s that way for a lot of people. I personally feel like the rappers are the stars of hip-hop, with their face-recognition of course, but in terms of making the important decisions in hip-hop, it comes down to the producers. What’s been more significant in the last five years? That now everybody talks about guns, that people like Timbaland are doing bizarre-ass shit with keyboards, that some guys doing new sample-based shit, or that then there’s The Neptunes? The instrumentation is really where the progression and cutting-edge element of hip-hop is showing. I find it kind of peculiar that people treat Timbaland and Premier like they’re Jesus or something, but I can understand why because I’m a big fan too.
Voice Leisure: What do you think about the fact that some of them are moving into more pop songs as well?
RJD2: That’s natural. It’s not anything new. Rappers having been doing shit with pop stars since the ‘80s. If the product sucks, then yeah, it’s bad. Obviously, you can’t consider everything the Neptunes do as hip-hop, but that doesn’t mean that it’s bad. I think the Justin Timberlake album is a pretty good record. You could say that I’m out of my fucking mind, but for a pop record, it’s good. When you’re at that level production-wise, it’s very hard to do something cutting edge and to take chances, and that’s why I have that much more respect for someone like Timbaland. He’s by far my favorite big-time, major-label producer. He’s managed to slide in the back door of pop or ” really high-exposure hip-hop,” whatever you want to call it, with some pretty bizarre shit. I think that he takes a lot more chances than anyone on his level.
Voice Leisure: With Def Jux becoming one of the more popular underground hip-hop labels, how vital do you think your role as a producer is to the label’s success?
RJD2: I don’t really think that it’s vital. In a lot of ways I kind of feel like the outsider. A lot of people really don’t look at my records as rap music or hip-hop. I feel like I exist outside that matrix. I don’t think I have too much bearing on the destiny of the label. It’s not that I don’t feel a part of it. Those guys are my friends and I love them. It’s a good situation. But Def Jux is going to do what it’s going to do whether I’m here or not.
Voice Leisure: You mentioned feeling like an outsider. Would you prefer a situation in which you were around more people similar to you or who do what you do?
RJD2: That’s the question I usually get from fans of Def Jux artists. I don’t really think about it too much. I listen to what I listen to. The most tired possible conversation you can have right now with me is like, “what is hip-hop and who is hip-hop?” I’m constantly listening to the radio to see what’s new, like what’s the next single they’re going to drop off the Joe Budden record. I also listen to Radiohead, Nick Drake and folk and that’s not anything different. Discussing genres is the most boring thing to me right now. Nobody listens to one thing. The most hardcore knucklehead rappers I know are listening to ‘80s pop shit. Nobody can just listen to rap music. If you do, you’re a fucking idiot. Even the most hardcore hip-hop heads or whatever, they at least listen to R&B music. That’s why I just feel like at the end of the day people have diverse tastes and no one wants to hear the same shit over and over.
Voice Leisure: So what’s the deal with all the cracked skulls on your album covers?
RJD2: Oh man, I didn’t even realize that; it just kind of happened. I’m not some gloomy guy. On the first album, I picked the title before I picked the cover. For the EP, they took a track off the album and did a maxi-single type of thing with it. The Horror was going to be the next single, so it naturally became the lead on the EP. I inadvertently ended up with two things in my catalog that are all bloody and doom-and gloom-looking, but I’m done with that.
